Author Topic: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%  (Read 18653 times)

THS79

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #15 on: April 29, 2017, 03:18:35 pm »
Hello,

what I do not understand regarding reflow discussion.
It was programmed in the past in a complex manner and made available in the software. Now it was removed from the source code. An option would have been a minimal effort.
It would be different if it had to be programmed.

With most emails I see no big difference. For some, the old procedure is better, for the others are the new one.

Otherwise, software is further developed and can not be customized for everyone.
That must be accepted.

Microsoft, for example, not everyone has switched to Vista ...

Many Thanks, Thomas

mikeone

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #16 on: April 29, 2017, 10:36:45 pm »
It is better as it is now than before. As a user, I prefer the way it zooms now without changing the message structure/view
No, it is emphatically not better. It may be better for YOU, but you cannot generalise that.
I've been trying to search the forum for the details on this change.  Does this mean that if you resize the message content with two-finger pinching it will not reformat the text so that it re-flows within the new area dimensions?  And that you may now need to horizontally scroll to view text that did not re-flow?
Um, I realized the new behavior and my first thought was: It must be a bug in Android's web view (recently updated from Play Store).

if it is actually a conscious change in AM's app code, then it's a limitation of usability and IMHO actually no improvement.
« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 12:53:07 am by mikeone »

Davey126

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #17 on: April 30, 2017, 12:42:00 am »
Given the way this was rolled out (no advance notice; intentional omission from change log; defending latter on the basis of not driving negative ratings in Play Store..really?) my view is this is an irreversible executive decision made on 'mount high' on behalf of ignorant an user base who clearly can't think for themselves and don't recognize good design when they see it. Thank you for saving us from ourselves by not providing a toggle that would reenable auch a horrible UI and thus present a distressing UX that might drive negative Play Store ratings. After all, that's what it's all about - 5 star nervana.

Kostya Vasilyev

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #18 on: April 30, 2017, 03:14:56 pm »
Re: Given the way this was rolled out (no advance notice

What do you mean "no advance notice"?

There was advance notice, here, on the forum, in development builds, with discussions on pros vs. cons, including a detailed explanation (by yours truly) about why this change was necessary and is an improvement (IMO).

And there are users who did agree - and those who didn't obviously.

Perhaps you wish for some kind of "advance notice" on Play? There is no such thing. A "what's new in this release" goes with an actual version update.

It is possible to edit the "description" in Play, but who's going to read this, seriously?

So this forum *is* the place where:

- We post "development" (work in progress) builds

- There is someone (myself) who often explains changes / features / etc. in depth

- There are direct user-to-developer discussions happening all the time

Speaking of "corporate things", does Outlook or TypeMail have anything like it?

Re: intentional omission from change log

Yes. Because if you tell people that you've changed (removed) something - they'll start complaining -- even if they wouldn't have even noticed otherwise.

That's just psychology, and has nothing to do with "way of doing business" etc.

So we actually want to see how many users will notice without us telling them "hey look, we removed something".

Re: Thank you for saving us from ourselves by not providing a toggle that would reenable auch a horrible UI and thus present a distressing UX

The trouble with "more and more" settings is their poor discover-ability.

---

And I'll say it again:

The actual change is "avoid scroll jumping that happens if you reflow on zoom" and we got complaints about that jump all the time.

There is no more jumping, it's now actually possible to zoom in "something".
« Last Edit: April 30, 2017, 03:22:01 pm by Kostya Vasilyev, Aqua Mail »
Creating debug logs for diagnostics: https://www.aqua-mail.com/troubleshooting/

The official FAQ: https://www.aqua-mail.com/faq/

Лог-файлы для диагностики: https://www.aqua-mail.com/ru/troubleshooting/

Вопросы и ответы: https://www.aqua-mail.com/ru/faq/

Geezer

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #19 on: April 30, 2017, 04:24:36 pm »
Kostya wrote:
So this forum *is* the place where:
- We post "development" (work in progress) builds
- There is someone (myself) who often explains changes / features / etc. in depth
- There are direct user-to-developer discussions happening all the time

Speaking of "corporate things", does Outlook or TypeMail have anything like it?

I don't know if those other businesses provide the same level of communication; likely not since you have suggested that they don't.  Regardless, this forum and your participation in it is, I think, quite uncommon and greatly appreciated.

Kostya wrote:
Re: intentional omission from change log
Yes. Because if you tell people that you've changed (removed) something - they'll start complaining -- even if they wouldn't have even noticed otherwise.

I believe this "Shhh, don't say anything and maybe they won't notice" approach to feature changes is misguided.  It suggests that you (and/or Mobi I suppose) are trying to sneak changes into the app that may be unexpected and controversial.  It gives the impression, to me at least, that you're unsure of and not committed to the benefit of the change. Unless you are considering a career change I think your talents are wasted on trying to manage user psychology.

Kostya wrote:
The trouble with "more and more" settings is their poor discover-ability.

I think that AquaMail has long since passed the point where the number of settings is an issue.  Just think, a search feature has been added to the settings screen to assist us.  It is right to look long and hard at adding new settings options, especially for new features.  But in cases where long-time functions are modified and no longer work the same, and the change is likely to be controversial, as is this re-flow change, then a setting may well be worth considering.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2017, 03:21:13 pm by Geezer »

Davey126

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #20 on: May 01, 2017, 02:51:40 pm »
Re: Given the way this was rolled out (no advance notice

What do you mean "no advance notice"?

There was advance notice, here, on the forum, in development builds, with discussions on pros vs. cons, including a detailed explanation (by yours truly) about why this change was necessary and is an improvement (IMO).

And there are users who did agree - and those who didn't obviously.

Perhaps you wish for some kind of "advance notice" on Play? There is no such thing. A "what's new in this release" goes with an actual version update.

It is possible to edit the "description" in Play, but who's going to read this, seriously?

So this forum *is* the place where:

- We post "development" (work in progress) builds

- There is someone (myself) who often explains changes / features / etc. in depth

- There are direct user-to-developer discussions happening all the time

Speaking of "corporate things", does Outlook or TypeMail have anything like it?

Re: intentional omission from change log

Yes. Because if you tell people that you've changed (removed) something - they'll start complaining -- even if they wouldn't have even noticed otherwise.

That's just psychology, and has nothing to do with "way of doing business" etc.

So we actually want to see how many users will notice without us telling them "hey look, we removed something".

Re: Thank you for saving us from ourselves by not providing a toggle that would reenable auch a horrible UI and thus present a distressing UX

The trouble with "more and more" settings is their poor discover-ability.

---

And I'll say it again:

The actual change is "avoid scroll jumping that happens if you reflow on zoom" and we got complaints about that jump all the time.

There is no more jumping, it's now actually possible to zoom in "something".
Hard to argue against this rational as it is self serving and thus largely impenetrable. Unless one follows this thread religiously subtle changes can go unnoticed among the background noise. As a Google Play beta tester I received notice of an update and (as always) scanned the change log for recent developments. Since only 'popular' changes are now being included that no longer serves as a reliable communication medium. I've seen developers take this path - only tell the user community a filtered version of reality, in particular omitting items that may lead to negative ratings. Hopefully this is a one off; likely I have missed other changes that were deamed too unpopular to publish.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2017, 03:29:41 pm by Davey126 »

Kostya Vasilyev

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #21 on: May 02, 2017, 08:24:55 pm »
Actually I'm not sure if this change made it into any of the "beta" releases on Google Play.
Creating debug logs for diagnostics: https://www.aqua-mail.com/troubleshooting/

The official FAQ: https://www.aqua-mail.com/faq/

Лог-файлы для диагностики: https://www.aqua-mail.com/ru/troubleshooting/

Вопросы и ответы: https://www.aqua-mail.com/ru/faq/

Davey126

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #22 on: May 02, 2017, 11:41:35 pm »
Actually I'm not sure if this change made it into any of the "beta" releases on Google Play.
It did as that's where I acquired 351 (Google Play).

das1996

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2017, 01:51:23 am »
@Kostya  Can we expect to see this feature turn in the next beta?

If not, is it safe to downgrade the apk of an older version after updating to current?

Nadejda Fudulska, MobiSystems, AquaMail support

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #24 on: May 03, 2017, 06:24:56 pm »
Thank you all for your valuable feedback. We are monitoring it but we have not made the decision yet.

AquaJet

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #25 on: May 03, 2017, 10:21:52 pm »
Nadejda, please see my post about this issue in a different thread
https://www.aqua-mail.com/forum/index.php?topic=5669.msg34392#msg34392

I hope your monitoring will result in the right decision. Thank you!

D.N.

mikeone

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #26 on: May 03, 2017, 11:31:28 pm »
Nadejda, please see my post about this issue in a different thread
https://www.aqua-mail.com/forum/index.php?topic=5669.msg34392#msg34392

I hope your monitoring will result in the right decision. Thank you!

D.N.
+1(00) 💯
Thanks @AquaJet for your feedback

Philip

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #27 on: May 03, 2017, 11:56:15 pm »
I have to agree with AquaJet as well.

In every other respect AquaMail is the best Android mail client that I have used, but this change is a deal breaker for me, and despite the time and effort I have put in to configuring it, if the change is not reversed (or made an option), then I'll have to find a different mail client.

Philip

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2017, 01:14:05 am »
I have to agree with AquaJet as well.

In every other respect AquaMail is the best Android mail client that I have used, but this change is a deal breaker for me, and despite the time and effort I have put in to configuring it, if the change is not reversed (or made an option), then I'll have to find a different mail client.

Just a question (I'm not discussing your request).
Do you happen to know another email app that does reflow after zooming in?
I honestly don't know; I have yet to do the research and hence my comment about having to find another mail client.

However, even if I find that such a thing does not exist, then I'm afraid that I would still move. I would rather use a mail client that never claimed to have a particular feature, than one which had it (in a paid version, to boot) and then removed it, especially when the removal was deliberately and cynically omitted from the change log.

What confidence can I have that other useful features won't get get removed from AquaMail in the future?

StR

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Re: Version 1.9.0-351 - Google Play - staged rollout at 50%
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2017, 03:50:06 am »
However, even if I find that such a thing does not exist, then I'm afraid that I would still move. I would rather use a mail client that never claimed to have a particular feature, than one which had it (in a paid version, to boot) and then removed it, especially when the removal was deliberately and cynically omitted from the change log.

What confidence can I have that other useful features won't get get removed from AquaMail in the future?

"That's it!.."

;)