Message Deleted Really Permanently Inadvertently

[Kostya Vasilyev]

Kostya wrote: "And the suggestion is -- to exclude "permanent delete" from "undo", so it's always caught by confirmations?"

  Yes, just permanent deletions.  The Undo setting would continue to default to "On".

What about users who don't have any issues using undo in combination with "delete permanently" and maybe even enjoy it?

Kostya wrote: "What if the user presses the "yes, I confirm, go ahead with the delete" accidentally, while trying to catch the phone?"

  The email is permanently deleted.  Sorry, we (you, actually) cannot handle all cases where someone is trying to catch their phone.

OK.

So if we agree that no matter what the UI, there may always be accidental / unintended presses (including catching the phone or just "um, I just tapped OK without reading what it said") -- is it worth trying to fix the case that started this discussion?

[mikeone]

Re: when the user might  press the delete button ('Delete permantly') accidentally, while trying to catch the phone

What if the user presses the "yes, I confirm, go ahead with the delete" accidentally, while trying to catch the phone?

In this case, the user would have pressed accidentally two different buttons consecutively. Iin my opinion very unlikely:

1^st - Delete permantly ('behind' the Overflow menu)
        > therefore this is already the second press

2^nd(3^rd) - Confirmation message

[Geezer]

Kostya wrote: "What about users who don't have any issues using undo in combination with "delete permanently" and maybe even enjoy it?"

The behavior would change.  If they have Undo enabled and don't want the (new) permanent confirmation then they have to turn it off.


Kostya wrote:
"So if we agree that no matter what the UI, there may always be accidental / unintended presses (including catching the phone or just "um, I just tapped OK without reading what it said") -- is it worth trying to fix the case that started this discussion?"


I think the fact that Undo is transient is relevant here, and for whatever reason there's a chance it won't be invoked.  To be honest, I don't feel strongly about this proposal even though I offered a suggestion on how it might be addressed.  Perhaps this issue is not a strong enough case to change the way the app works.

[mikeone]

Kostya wrote: "And the suggestion is -- to exclude "permanent delete" from "undo", so it's always caught by confirmations?"

  Yes, just permanent deletions.  The Undo setting would continue to default to "On".

What about users who don't have any issues using undo in combination with "delete permanently" and maybe even enjoy it?

This user could disable the (new) option
'Keep (don't skip) confirmation before permanently deleting messages [_]

[mikeone]

Kostya wrote: "What about users who don't have any issues using undo in combination with "delete permanently" and maybe even enjoy it?"

The behavior would change.  If they have Undo enabled and don't want the (new) permanent confirmation then they have to turn it off.

Yes.
However, I recommend to implement this enhancement as an additional option (as described before), since the logic behind would be clearer for the average user.

[Kostya Vasilyev]

Let's come back to the specifics of the initial message.

It seems that the issue only exists on the message view screen, and only for this "secondary" menu item, i.e. when the account's "delete method" is specifically not "delete permanently"

( when it is, it's a button in the button bar below )

On Windows, I'd just put a separator above "delete permanently". Alas, Android menus do not support separators.

How about this then:

Exclude this specific case of "delete permanently" from "undo"? Unconditionally (no setting)?

I mean just the "delete permanently" menu item in the overflow menu specifically of message view specifically?

[mikeone]

Let's come back to the specifics of the initial message.

It seems that the issue only exists on the message view screen, and only for this "secondary" menu item, i.e. when the account's "delete method" is specifically not "delete permanently"

( when it is, it's a button in the button bar below )

Yes, correct.

The problem ("use" case) is as follows:

The item 'Delete permantly 'is usually located near the bottom of the "overflow" menu (see screenshot #1)
> if the user tries to scroll the list (e.g. one-handed) it is very likely that he will hit accidentally the item 'Delete permantly'...then, surprisingly the "Undo-panel' appears - but times out quickly - the user will get in 'panic' -  trying to hit the 'Undo-button' (remember: the device is in 'one-handed' use), but missed it and the message get lost... permanently.

How about this then:

Exclude this specific case of "delete permanently" from "undo"? Unconditionally (no setting)?

I mean just the "delete permanently" menu item in the overflow menu specifically of message view specifically?

This could be a solution (workaround?):
Move the setting 'Confirm when deleting messages' right below of the item 'Confirm' Mark all read' = excluding this case from "Undo".

However, I'm not sure if this solution would be sufficient for users who a) explicitly don't want to  confirm , but  b) instead need an undo function for this action.

That's the reason for my suggestion to add  an (sub) option:
http://www.aqua-mail.com/forum/index.php?topic=4963.msg28729#msg28729